banana-that-dislikes-carrot:

midnight-in-town:

I love how people are joking that our!Ciel is The One Who Shall Not Be Named, when in reality

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Claudia 

is.

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Because okay sure we know her name, unlike our!Ciel’s, but damn if we ever find out about anything else when it comes to her in the plot

She’s looming behind the truth of a big part of the main plot, or at least that’s the impression Sensei is giving me (oh yeah I’ll bet you anything that she’s very significant), but no real mention yet about anything besides her name

sensei when

our!Ciel we know everything about and we have followed but don’t know his name. 

Claudia, we know her name but almost nothing else. 

There are so many other characters that I want to know more about, like Francis, Undertaker, the Shinigami’s, Meyrin and Baldo. I want to know what makes them who they are!!! 

True that, @banana-that-dislikes-carrot! Well, if that reassures you (in case you didn’t know), we’re bound to find out more about Mey and Bard at some point because Sensei said she’d reveal how they came to work for Ciel

Since Mey is Chinese, I’m guessing her arc will also be related to whatever Lau & Ran Mao’s arc we’ll be getting? Just guessing though. 

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As for the recurring Shinigamis, like Grell and the others, there is no guarantee but  I’m guessing that when we learn about how the organization works exactly (and what’s up with those superiors), we might find out about some elements of their past.

Finally, for Frances, UT, Tanaka, Claudia and even Vincent I’m guessing this will be more or less addressed through the same discussions/answer moments and since this is main plot material, it can’t be helped that Sensei is taking her time.

I mean, we have Othello who made a comment that might be implying he met Claudia when she was a little girl 50 years ago + Othello knew UT as a Shinigami, so I think he’ll be doing the honors at some point during this arc, maybe giving Ciel a few answers, which will hopefully lead him to ask for more to anyone who might be aware of what UT did after his desertion.

These people, besides UT himself (in case he may not feel like talking, as we saw in ch141), are most likely Tanaka and Frances, that is at least what seems to be making the most sense (considering they also both knew Claudia) and anyway they are fishy too, at least as far as the current narrative goes.  

=> Tanaka because he joined the Phantomhive family when Claudia was the Watchdog so he is bound to know quite a lot about her death and some circumstances behind Vincent’s death too…

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And Frances because it was hinted she might become “an examplar to Ciel” very early on in the story (interesting when he still knows almost nothing about his family and it’s most likely the opposite for her), and yet now she’s nowhere to be seen even though we saw everyone else from the family. 

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So it’s not like Sensei can avoid to eventually answer all of this. TBH though, I just wish the pacing wasn’t so… slow. 

I mean, I get building the plot and wanting to focus each volume around certain developments but :// well, this is killing me. 3 years on this arc and we still don’t know how the blood transfusions came to be, how real!Ciel is so perfectly undead and if UT is truly alone behind the sect. Amongst other things.

The hopes I have is that once we get past the chess game between the twins, we will find out about the Phantomhive family, Claudia and UT, but until we’re there, 20 pages/a month is haaaard because it’s making the wait so much longer.  

I can’t blame Yana though: since Claudia was made to be so mysterious ever since volume 8, giving answers about her is very probably giving out big big hints towards the main plot and the target of Ciel’s revenge (to us and to Ciel himself), so she gotta build it up as much as she finds it necessary.

For me this arc is targeting Ciel’s long overdue character development, but it’d be cool if we could learn more about the P family (which basically means about Claudia since personally I think she’s the start of everything) within the next 5 years too.

midnight-in-town:

I love this because Claudia #1 master confirmed yay! but also because “I have served this family for two generations so I don’t really care who is the head of the family amongst you fighting siblings, I’m just here to keep an eye over all of you and watch the fort”.

I love this because it’s like “you’re all Phantomhives as regards me”, by UT in ch131 and the two men are definitely foiling each other. They have been here since Claudia’s time and she could very well be the reason they decided they’d stay for the following generations.

So not only do I truly wonder what kind of an awesome woman she was (but that’s not new), but I guess neither Tanaka nor UT will be the ones who will put an end to this chess game between the twins because they’re not on either side.

hey i just gotta add quickly that 

  • UT and Tanaka both knew that our!Ciel was lying about his identity, 
  • they both know stuff about the P family that they’ve been more or less not telling our!Ciel
  • they both knew Claudia and Vincent
  • and they seem to care about both twins (unless the rcmt is a thing and Tanaka is just pretending

The last character who could be fitting the exact same criteria (with a remaining question mark on the first) has been missing for a while but her children and her husband are (supposedly) coming home with “the truth”.

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Unlike Tanaka and UT though, I wonder if Frances might really stay a neutral party? 

First of all, there is Lizzie’s sorrow that might motivate her to do something/anything, especially if she already knew about our!Ciel lying and feels bad about not telling her daughter, which led to the current arc in a way.

Secondly, considering the comic relief around her character, I’d say her not getting along with UT could be a real thing and in that case she has no reason to go along with whatever plan he supports/be as neutral as he and Tanaka are? 

IDK but it’s something to think about. 

Gotta love the “I don’t tell lies” part of Seb’s aesthetic, because he’s forced to take this even more seriously by the contract, which results in…

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having to admit that he can’t sit down in the extra chapter, partially because it’s not proper to be sitting with his master, sure, but also because he’d rather not take the risk to sit his ass with UT being around. xD

blackreapersreign:

midnight-in-town:

Crack theory: the Phantomhive lineage is at the origin of the Watchdog duty

Very old idea related to ch103 & the GW arc overall that I never took the time to write. 

Based on the fact that Claudia was most likely Vincent’s predecessor, which is implying that, when no more male heir available, using a woman from the Phantomhive family as the Watchdog was apparently a better alternative than giving the job to another nobleman loyal to the royal family.

@frederickabberline previously made a post explaining under which circumstances noble women could inherit anything, so it isn’t strange that Claudia was able to get that title. Still, the Watchdog position implies keeping control over the underworld, solving weird cases and cleaning up after the royal family, so it’s not exactly a normal position.

To keep it within a family specifically (the Phantomhives) could be a matter of keeping the Watchdog’s identity a secret, but…

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…clearly ch132 and Vincent explain that, if no more heir, the whole thing goes back to the crown who decides who they’ll give it to next. So it’s probably Victoria who decided to give it to Claudia in the first place, allowing her to inherit despite being a woman (we don’t know when) and…

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it’s also the Queen who decided that a 10 year old boy from the same family would receive that position. 

So, assuming that the royal family intends on keeping the Watchdog duty as tightly related to the P family as possible, the question is why? Well, my answer for now would be the lineage thing.

Granted that we don’t know exactly what that lineage is yet, why it apparently has to be activated, etc, but it seems to at least have to do with being able to see/sense/detect supernatural beings. So far:

  • Ciel managed to spot the Shinigamis in ch103 despite them being invisible to normal human eyes at the time
  • there is a suspicion about Frances also being able to see through Seb’s human disguise (not saying she knows he’s a demon, but at least that he’s not human)
  • the German Shinigamis said that “it runs in the family” so we can assume that it spans more than just two generations (so it’s most likely unrelated to whoever Cedric K. Ros- is) 

And I’m of the opinion that it could probably be seen as useful if the royal family were to know about (and believe) it. 

For now though, it’s hard to consider whether or not Victoria herself gave out hints that she might know about the lineage, because her absence of surprise towards Ciel’s report for the Weston arc could also be explained by John Brown most likely being supernatural and by her side, as many have guessed before.

The thing is, I find there is a possible analogy between the Watchdog’s duty

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and Seb’s own situation as Ciel’s personal dog

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Because Will basically said that a demon with a leash on (the contract & Seb’s own aesthetic) was better than free demons who would probably go around scavenging for souls that Shinigamis work hard to collect. 

And it’s kinda the same if we’re considering that the Phantomhives are dogs to the royal family: putting a collar on them makes them less dangerous and more easy to keep under control (eventually hanging them with it if needs be, as UT pointed out), especially if what the royal family was originally interested in was how useful the Phantomhive lineage could be to them. 

The other reason I came up with this theory is the Green Witch arc overall: again it’s just my opinion but, while the last part of the arc was really good, I have a few issues with the rest of it.
I explained here why but, to sum up: compared to all the other arcs, the fake supernatural settings (werewolves, witch, curse/magic, etc) are rather unrelated to the true subplot (German army researching war weapons using a young genius), which is unusual and makes it too convenient as a result. 

That being said, since I like to believe that Sensei does things for a reason, I’ve been thinking that maybe the fake supernatural settings of the GW arc are supposed to be relevant elsewhere in the story, kinda like how the murders at manor arc ended up being used as an introduction to the war suplot. 

So initially, looking at what Sieglinde believed to be the truth, you get this story…

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and let’s just say that this is a situation that could have easily been applied to the Phantomhive family, if anyone ever found out that they were “gifted”.

Again, we don’t know what the lineage is or where it comes from, but if Ciel’s ancestors ended up being hunted as heretics

at some point

because of it, then similarly to Sieglinde’s story, who knows if they didn’t agree to a pact with the royal family (the Watchdog duty), in exchange for their protection?

That pact gave the royal family the huge advantage to get their own little gifted dogs, generations after generations, and to use that special lineage indirectly for themselves…

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…as long as they kept a tight leash on this family.  


I’m aware it might appear a little far-fetched, especially when we don’t know what the lineage

really

is about yet, but that’s why it’s a crack theory. 

To be honest though, I can’t help but also wonder about the timing of the lineage thing’s introduction by Sensei: ch103 is right during the final part of the GW arc after all, so it could be a coincidence or narratively meaningful because the settings of the arc do have some sort of link to that lineage stuff. :))

Let me know if anything is unclear! As always thanks for reading!!

For the first part of this theory, I completely agree with OP, I’ve had the same thoughts for some time now (I just don’t think I’ve ever written anything on it, so good job, OP). The one about the Phantomhive lineage being at the origin of the Watchdog duty. It’s a theory I very strongly support.

In fact, I consider Undertaker as being perhaps even the very first Watchdog, the first Earl of Phantomhive, the one who first took the ‘curse of being the watchdog’, so to say. Perhaps, rather than an obsession, he’s feeling responsible for brining that ‘curse’ into the family. That’s why he ‘doesn’t want to lose any more Phantomhives’ and he seems more attached to ones who still hold the Phantomhive name, Vincent + the twins, rather than Frances and her family.

Of course, the part about UT is still a bit of a crack-ish theory, so yeah. ^^

@blackreapersreign thank you for reading and for your input. 🙂 

The theory of UT being the very first Watchdog/Earl Phantomhive (or supposed to be but he killed himself before it happened and the title got passed to another relative) is by far an old fandom theory, which I also stand behind because, for now, there isn’t just one way to explain UT’s close association to the Phantomhive family.

So, sure I agree, UT being a Phantomhive many many decades/centuries ago could be an explanation, just like him simply feeling very close to Claudia is another (and a third option would be a combo of both)! 

Besides an obvious connection and emotional attachment, personally I think UT also shares another similarity to them anyway

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since I believe his words of ch35 also reflect something that he went through (and that possibly led to his suicide).

If you don’t mind though, I’ll pass on the whole “he seems to care more about Vincent’s side of the family than Frances” because, while it’s indeed possible, I think it’s way too soon to say, especially since fans used to have the same debate about UT @ the twins, until ch131 confirmed it wasn’t the case. 🙂

So between that and the whole comic relief around Frances’ character that could be stemming from UT’s character, implying there is a possible history between them (and which could explain the lack of interactions between UT and the Midfords so far), I’m just not agreeing with this for now.

Besides, if our!Ciel hadn’t come back, it’s quite possible that Frances would have ended up as the next Watchdog (most likely being Vincent’s old spare and all) and in that case, your idea of UT feeling guilty about that curse would also end up applying to her. 

Sorry for rambling, but thanks again for your input! :))

pretty sure the Undertaker used to be a nobleman/aristocrat

Either before he became a Shinigami, or between deserting the Shinigamis and becoming “the Undertaker” (so sometimes during the last 50 years). 

Because who else besides nobles go hunting?

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And how would he have known how to fit in perfectly with high society if he never was one of them?

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Also who else wears rings similar to his?

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An anon even mentioned to me once that the fact he wears his ring on his index finger was most likely because his ring was a status symbol of some specificity (which would be why another noble like Vincent also wore his on the same finger). 

Wouldn’t be impossible that I forgot more hints, so feel free to add them. :))

Crack thought: Seb is being hauled off to Viscount of Druitt

genemenom:

I got to thinking, how much does Undertaker know about the negotiation talk between OCiel and Sebastian? Since he asked OCiel if it made any difference if RCiel was actually alive or dead. 

Viscount has long been theorized to have been part of the Satanic Cult. He’s already known to be taking part in occult activities. 

 And he does have an assistant who has… much of the same outfit. Especially the mask.

And we know Undertaker likes good ol’ slave auctioneer Viscount of Druitt. 

(I mean they have that occupuation in common after all. Dealing in human trafficking lol Undertaker ur a real scumbag aintcha. But that’s a different topic.)

The viscount is a funny guy, and a doctor. Someone who would be able to help Undie with the science-y bits that Undertaker isn’t very good at, according to Othello

Anyway, I just thought… Does Undertaker know that Seb doesn’t take on multiple contractors? If he didn’t see the thing about “hey, necromancy is #notcool” that OCiel said, did he see the bit with Seb’s contract policy?

I don’t know about the specifics of the process of “giving Sebastian to the Viscount” but if Undertaker has promised the Viscount that he’d get a demon contract if he helped him with this Bizarre Doll Project, I wouldn’t surprised. 

What UT could be after

midnight-in-town:

Basically I think that one possibility for this arc, as far as our!Ciel is concerned, is that UT (with real!Ciel) is trying to get rid of the two dangers constantly lurking around our!Ciel.

You heard the man, he doesn’t want to lose more Phantomhives 

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and that definitely includes our!Ciel (he even said that he made no difference between the twins, in ch131).

To protect our!Ciel tho’, he gotta eliminate the Watchdog duty that’s like a collar Ciel will hang himself with at some point: 

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and that’s where the dead twin (and first heir) getting his title back could be useful since he’s already dead. So even if Victoria gets to him (since personally I think she’s the big bad), no can end like Vincent and Claudia.

The second danger is Seb 

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and that could be why Bravat (who was most likely speaking for UT) literally said he could offer help in dealing with Seb during his fortune telling. 

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Maybe that’s even what the whole framing thing is supposed to lead to. Somehow.

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So I don’t know for sure, but it seems UT hasn’t lost his mind and still hasn’t reached his goal, as himself told Othello

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and I think that is true, just like Sensei implying that he’s actually not a villain after ch131 came out. 

Obviously the whole scheme is super complex, but if UT is after besting the Queen and a hungry demon in one go for our!Ciel’s sake, then he has to have no limit, including using people like Bravat who had a sad life or the S4 and then throwing them away.

I made a separate post, but then I figured it was better to add it to the first post I did on the subject, sorry for the double post

About our!Ciel being framed

TBH, the thing that is bothering me with the “let’s frame my bro” conspiracy is that no one is wondering about why exactly our!Ciel would go as far as to kill citizens to get their blood. 

Like ??? what would be his goal in doing that as Lord Sirius/the blue star/the sect’s mastermind? Especially since real!Ciel is the one who was saying “oh I was in a very bad shape until recently” in front of everyone in ch143. 

So I don’t want to call this a plot hole yet, because clearly it’s not the only part that’s not holding on (as far as characters like Ed could obviously notice), but maybe the whole framing plan is mainly working out because revealing that our!Ciel was lying for the past 4 years is increasing the doubts and confusion of the witnesses.  

…Actually, since it’s definitely not an accusation that’s holding out so well, maybe the true goal is not even to frame Ciel himself. For example, UT could go next with…

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“oh but Queen Victoria is the one who asked her Watchdog to create such an operation, because she’s preparing for war and wanted to experiment about blood transfusions :)))))” or an equivalent. 

Because that would suddenly become very bad publicity for Victoria (killing her own people o.m.g + have you seen all the many witnesses that are just in time to hear about this), whom coincidentally UT doesn’t like at all…

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Add that to the murders of the Parliamentarians (ch125) that Ciel could be accused of as well and…

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…it could be one more argument that she asked her Watchdog to get them out of the way because they were getting in the way of her war plans. 

Besides, that’s how Abberline was introduced to the Watchdog duty (ch15):

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…so even he (who seems to be believing in our!Ciel right now) could start thinking that he was played for a fool, all for the Queen’s profit, if that’s the explanation he receives.

Ciel does work for Victoria after all and that’s something Abberline, Alexis and Edward all definitely know.

Never mind me rambling, but guys, I still can’t believe UT would simply want our!Ciel framed so that, with him out of the way, the title can go back to “the rightful heir”. That seems illogical when UT despises the Watchdog duty and said he didn’t wan’t to lose more Phantomhives.

TL;DR Ciel is not necessarily the one who’s really being framed here, if just because the accusation hardly stands if someone starts wondering about why he was after all that blood in the first place.

Meanwhile, UT has two enemies: Victoria and Seb. So maybe the whole point is to get to one of them (or both) by eventually pinning this whole case on them with our!Ciel being considered merely a pawn? 

1/1 I’m glad to hear that I was afraid you would get annoyed by the long ask but with this arc I can’t help myself since it involves so many characters and we may even get the long awaited UT’s flashback and why he is so obsessed with the phantomhives That’s true but if our Ciel get over his guilt and start to accept himself he may start to think about saving his soul ?

shinigami-mistress:

2/2 Of course as readers we are aware of how strong and capable he is but also of how fragile he can be .I think he does need someone else because the reason he sees himself that way is mostly because of the people around him .So perhaps Frances would get the job done but then again his other aunt told him she wish he was never born so I wonder what to expect from this one ?

3/3 That’s why I think he is insane because he doesn’t even see how wrong his actions are (just look at all the people who died during the compania arc) .I won’t call him batshit crazy but I don’t think he is mentally healthy .True ,and thank you for answering .

Hello again, Anon. Sorry for the delay in answering this time.

I think Undertaker’s obsession with the families is one of those mysteries a lot of us want to know. How did he get involved with them? Is it Claudia? In all reality, I think it will be some of the last things to be revealed, so we can only guess at this point. I do look for a detailed flashback.

A long time ago, I was working on different ways the contract could be voided when a friend pointed out that our!Ciel doesn’t want to break the contract. However, I think his guilt is only a tiny part of that. Another part is that was the deal that he made with Sebastian, and he isn’t looking to back out on his end of the deal. Remember he sacrificed his own identity. Just because his brother returned doesn’t change that fact.

Our!Ciel’s perception of himself isn’t just the way other people around him saw him. He did hear people talking about how he was suited to be the watchdog, but that’s actually not really an insult. He was just more timid and shy. Our!Ciel’s view of himself came more from comparing himself to his brother, whom he had put on a pedestal. He loved and admired his twin, It’s even quite possible he saw real!Ciel as being even better than he really was because of how he felt about him.

I was talking to @midnight-in-town the other day and said that if Frances shows up, she could be the voice of reason in all this insanity. I still stand by that. I have a strong suspicion she knew that it was our!Ciel who had returned and not his brother, so I think she might be able to act rationally in this situation.

Madam Red did say that our!Ciel should have never been born. Looking back now, I wonder about that. Was she saying the twins should have never been born because she should have been the one with Vincent, or did she recognize this was our!Ciel and she compared her experiences of being the younger sibling to our!Ciel? Maybe it was both. Either way, you can’t really compare Madam Red and Frances just because both are/were his aunts. Madam Red was selfish. She was mired in this idea that she should have had Vincent, and couldn’t really move past it. Later tragedies caused her to lose her grip on her sanity. Frances may seem cold and hard, but she loves her family, and I believe she puts their needs before her own. She firmly rooted in reality. She may push our!Ciel to make him stronger. 

Personally I still think the person who will snap our!Ciel out of his current state is either himself, Lizzie, or Frances. I might be wrong, but that’s my guess.

Undertaker’s thinking and actions are certainly warped. He has canonically caused the deaths of more people in the manga than the literal demon. In his mind, he probably has justified it all, but it doesn’t seem rational to anyone else. A part of me wants him to have some moment of clarity so he can see what he’s truly done, but he might be too far gone.

Maybe Frances could bring him back to reality because she could remind him of Claudia, or possibly even Lizzie.

Thanks so much for writing. 🙂