Well, no, to be honest with you, I don’t think Matsumae survived that chainsaw and neither did Hairu, Karren or even Eto (who else is there?) when it comes to their own death circumstances.
Since you mentioned Eto, I have yet to reread TG but, about the last arc and last chapters of :Re, in my opinion Eto was actually dead all along. She died in Cochlea like she said she might…
it’s just that the Clowns collected her body and Donato made a dead puppet out of her to “stall for time” during the last arc.
It’s hard to explain how this works exactly, since the Clowns and their powers remained mysterious till the end, but whatever they used to make a puppet out of her, killing V was the only conscious thing she was able to do before she “died again”.
That’s just my opinion though. The other possibility is that she did survive Cochlea thanks to the Clowns (probably Nico who healed her) and they kept her as a prisoner until she could be useful, during the last arc, while controlled by Donato. The attacks she faced ended up killing her for good, even though she managed to take it out on V’s members a little.
Whichever option you prefer should be in theory correct as far as Eto goes.
However, Matsumae didn’t get so lucky (?). And besides, if she had survived, shouldn’t she have been by Shuu or Mirumo’s sides?
So, I’m sorry Anon but not likely for Matsumae. ://
As always, just my opinion though, you don’t have to agree. Have a nice weekend Anon! 🙂
um, maybe I’m just reading way too much into this, but it’s interesting that there is such a strong focus on Kaneki’s right eye in ch178 as he’s falling further and further away from the light, when in the sewers just before V14…
there was the suspicion of something having happened to his right eye (by @kingkishou and @dadneki).
As @sentrakk pointed out here, we’ve come and gone full circle compared to V14 at the end of the first TG (another primary example being Irimi and Koma dying “again” or Kaneki taking action because he doesn’t want to be unable to do anything anymore), which is why I’m wondering…
if this is really a random focus from Sensei’s part or not.
Maybe it’s really supposed to be a meaningless detail or maybe not and in that case, we could get another chapter about Kaneki’s inner self, like TG ch140, which was
actually
the last we saw of him in TG?
Sorry not to have anything very conclusive but we’re roaming through a sea of doubt till next week. ://
The thrilling saga of my “why TG is not ending yet” theories continues as I try to prove why this is not a matter of Ishida rushing his story to a premature end and he has actually planned to end :re at chapter 179 for a long time as well as to have the resolution arc as a separate entity. There seems to be a common theme in these latest chapters that supports this.
These current events parallel the end of part 1 in several ways, we for example have Ui, Juuzou, Hirako and rest of the gang battling the Owl
Kaneki going off on his own underground, because he’s tired of not being able to do anything
On the way a friend of his sacrifices themselves so that Kaneki can keep going forward and they go missing in the process
And he in a big underground area meets Arima and Furuta who he has to get past by using force. If Arima technically was the main villain of part 1, Furuta was that for :re, they are the obstacle Kaneki is meant to get past.
The main difference here is that while in part 1 Kaneki decided to die and succumbed to his flaws, here he is doing his best to live and move forward. Kaneki actually managed to learn this lesson and won thanks to it, his change in attitude highlighted by his discussion with Furuta. Kaneki never got past V14, but here he finally took one step closer to his goal and this is where the parallels end and he gets a happy ending, right?
There is a twist however, because Kaneki despite his pretty speeches about living has not yet reached the complete end of his journey and is instead still in the middle of Judgement, not the World. The biblical symbolism present is referencing the Book of Revelation, which happens to have an event called the Final Judgement. Also, in two poems Ishida has written in the past, the theme of judgement is present and those poems seem to match the current events rather than anything that has happened before. Judgement seems to be a recurring theme, which is important, because it is not the ending point of the journey, those V14 parallels I talked about just now will be relevant too.
Before anything else though, I’ll just roughly go through some of the Book of Revelation symbolism in the One Eyed King and Dragon arcs to get this started
In the beginning a scroll with 7 seals is presented to the Throne of God and it is declared that only the Lion of Judah, the Lamb, is worthy to open it. The Lamb was given praise and angels along with creatures from Heaven and Earth fell down before him.
I believe the Lamb in question is Kaneki who was given the role of the One Eyed King by Arima and Eto who represent God.
Both Arima and Eto are like gods in the series, Arima even has the nickname God of Death and is seen as one by the CCG and ghouls
Eto especially has a lot of biblical symbolism associated with her, for example the instance of her talking about Genesis with Karren and wanting to become her god. If Arima is the one who ultimately made Kaneki become the One Eyed King during Cochlea arc, Eto did most of her part of the job back in Tsukiyama Extermination arc by awakening his memories using Karren. The biblical symbolism with Karren and Eto becoming her god is what she tried to do to Kaneki as well
Both Arima and Eto were basically in the position of a God for Kaneki, Kaneki even was like a son to Arima (plus Eto wanted Kaneki to become her child) and has some Jesus symbolism associated with him. For instance him being stuck in the Dragon and being in coma lasted pretty much exactly three days before he woke up and was reunited with his loved ones.
Kaneki is also associated with goats a lot, with the book Black Goat’s Egg and the fact that he even named his organization Goat after becoming the One Eyed King, therefore it’s fitting that he is also the Lamb.
His role as the One Eyed King can be considered the scroll since once all of the 7 seals are opened, the Apocalypse begins, just like how Kaneki’s time as the One Eyed King only led to ruin, destruction and loss of lives. Even if Kaneki technically failed as a King, the outcome still happens to fit with Eto and Arima’s ideas of what the world will look like in the future. For Arima:
And Eto’s world that is yet to come
It is just around the corner though since once the Apocalypse is over, the old Earth and Heaven are replaced and there’s a new order of things in the world. What the story is heading towards is in fact quite literally a factory reset, but I’ll get to that more in detail later. What matters is that when Kaneki was given the scroll, it led to what it was supposed to lead to, the Apocalypse.
The six seals of the scrolls are undone and there was a great earthquake, the sun became black, every mountain, island were moved out of their places etc. Mankind hides from the one who sits on the throne and the wrath of the Lamb. The seventh seal is then broken, followed by half an hour of silence and destruction that devastates the Earth.
Typical apocalyptic events occur and this is represented in the story. The way the borders of the pages became black during Kaneki’s time as the Dragon might represent the sun becoming black, mountains and islands being moved out of their places is the same as all the buildings being devastated and there was an earthquake as Kaneki became the Dragon. Most notable one is chapter 145, which has no dialogue as it most likely represents the silence. Once the seventh seal is broken, numerous different kinds of devastating events occur that kill a huge chunk of humanity, but one particular thing Ishida seems to reference a lot is the bottomless pit.
As the star opens the bottomless pit, smoke rises from the Abyss like smoke from a gigantic furnace darkening the sun and the air. From the smoke locusts come out who are commanded not to harm anyone or anything except for people who were not given the “seal of God” on their foreheads. Locusts were commanded by the Abaddon, the angel of the Abyss who many interpret to be Satan himself.
This is a reference to the oviduct that houses Rize in the 19th ward since the place where she’s situated at is told to be a huge cave that seems pretty bottomless as Kaneki peers down it.
Furuta also has the key to the place where she resides before being interrupted by Kaneki. The bottomless pit is actually the place closest to Hell and Underworld where the Dragon is eventually banished to for 1000 years.This works since the Dragon present in the Book of Revelation is actually Rize rather Kaneki since he was just a tool Furuta used to turn Rize into her current form
Rize also represents Satan who commands the locusts as she is the one creating them and has St. Peter’s cross on her forehead. The Dragon in general is meant to represent Satan/Devil in the Book of Revelation.
The smoke rising from the pit is the poison that infects people with ROS and blackens the sky and the locusts are the kagune monsters that attack everyone and spread the disease in the process.
Since Rize is the true Dragon, Kaneki and his Dragon form represents the Beast emerging from the sea.
The sea being the sea of corpses from Kaneki’s mind where all the people he killed during his rampage went, the place by the Torii gates in his mind where he talked with Rize
It’s also noted that the Beast has a fatal wound, which they had miraculously healed, Kaneki too managed to heal his grave wounds and stop his aging by becoming the Beast.
There is also a second beast that emerges from the Earth known as the False Prophet. He exercises authority on the previous beast’s behalf and caused miraculous signs that cause people to follow the Beast. He is also connected to the Dragon.
The False Prophet is Furuta since while in the Book Revelation they would be the two Beasts, in TG they are the two kings that are very similar to each other. Kaneki’s Dragon form was also technically Furuta’s ally and it was what he called it himself too. People worshiping the Beasts was seen soon after Itori, who was working with Furuta, tried to manipulate the people from Goat.
While it wasn’t during the actual Apocalypse, we also saw the huge cult like following Kaneki had as well as the fact that Furuta himself was quite popular himself and even had a fan club.
The Beasts were good at making people follow them and worship them. There are probably some other references too, but these are just some of the bigger ones I noticed. What this all seems to be leading up to is the highlight and climax of the Book of Revelation, the Final Judgement.
Jesus finally returns to Earth, which the Beast and False Prophet try to fight with armies of their own before they are defeated. The Beast and the False Prophet are cast into the lake of fire while the Dragon is imprisoned in the bottomless pit for 1000 years. The Dragon is freed after 1000 years, tries to deceive all nations in four corners of the Earth and gathers people to fight the God, but is eventually defeated and cast into the lake of fire as well. The wicked dead and all of those who died during the thousand-year reign of Jesus are resurrected and judged. A new Heaven and new Earth replace the old ones and there is no more death or suffering as the old order of things has passed away.
Kaneki’s Dragon form, the Beast, has been defeated and while he was stuck there, he technically was working with Furuta, the False Prophet. And like I explained before, Kaneki has Jesus symbolism associated with him so he also takes the role of the one who fights and defeats the False Prophet, leading to both of the Beasts being taken down in the end. Rize the Dragon meanwhile is imprisoned in the bottomless pit, which was where all the smoke and locusts previously came from. Kaneki now has been imprisoned in the bottomless pit with Rize and is going to be stuck there for some time, which is going to represent the 1000 years of peace before he comes out with Rize and a new conflict arises. Kaneki caused the Dragon to be stopped so he as the Jesus is the one who allowed this period of peace to exist, which of course is followed by the Final Judgement after those 1000 years of imprisonment.
Kaneki also seems to take the role of archangel Gabriel, who resurrects the dead in the Judgement tarot card and is one of the angels that causes the Apocalypse to happen.
His appearance is like that of an angel with wings and crosses with a white color scheme. Chapter 164, where he gets his angelic appearance, is even called “The White One”. Archangel Gabriel blowing his horn on the Judgement tarot card is the thing that makes the dead rise from their graves and in the Book of Revelation a trumpet blast is said to proceed the resurrection of the dead. On the card is depicted a sea where caskets float and this sea of corpses is a recurring motif with Kaneki. There has been plenty of foreshadowing and teasing in the story about bringing back the dead, but we have yet to see any kind of payoff for it. Furuta mentions this being possible, but the Beast, Kaneki’s Dragon form, of course is not capable of doing it.
As the dead are resurrected, the old Heaven and Earth are replaced and like I mentioned before, it is essentially a factory reset. The factory reset that Eto wanted to see and who coincidentally happens to have returned just a few chapters ago even if that would be kind of pointless if there’s nothing left for her character to do in these final chapters. Arima is back too in a way, in spirit at least, during CCG’s fight with the Owl (Oh, and Hairu, the prime candidate to be resurrected is there too)
The Judgement symbolism carries over to Kaneki’s personal character development as well since with Fool’s Journey he is not at the World yet despite all his revelations, he is still at the Judgement.
The Judgement card calls for a period of reflection and self-evaluation. Through meditation or quiet reflection, you may come to a point of deep understanding about the common themes throughout your life and what you can do or change to avoid these situations in the future.
The Judgement card suggests that you have reviewed and evaluated your past experiences and have learned from them. All the pieces of the puzzle of your life are finally coming together to form one, integrated picture of your life story. This integration has healed any deep wounds and you are now in a position to put the past behind you. Your memories no longer haunt you, and you are able to understand and value what has happened to you and what it has taught you about life.
This is exactly what Kaneki talks to Furuta about, he has had his moment of self reflection and found peace with has past and where he is right now. He has had time to think about things and learn from his old mistakes, the past is no longer something that hurt him, but it is something that turned him into the person he is and gave him everything he has. He is completely content with it.
Judgement is about finding absolution. Through a period of self-evaluation, you will feel cleansed of your ‘sins’, wrongdoings and mistakes, and you will finally be released of your guilt and sorrow about the past.
Kaneki also acknowledges the fact that everybody in this world hurts each other and finds absolution. Kaneki committed a grave sin by becoming the Dragon and killing half of Tokyo, but he doesn’t get stuck on it and moves forward, he is at peace with everything that happened
You may even feel a calling – a personal conviction of what you are meant to do. If you are in a low period, in need of hope and absolution, Judgement can show you that renewal is at hand.
That doesn’t mean Kaneki is going to ignore all his wrongdoings and instead of just feeling guilty, he decides to take responsibility for his actions. This is Kaneki’s resolve to do something for the sake of people around him, him being tired of not being able to do anything and that resolve is not shaken even by Furuta as he moves forward towards his goal.
The angel on the Judgement card also represents the Fool’s higher self calling them to rise up and fulfill their promise so Kaneki doesn’t just physically represent the angel in question.
You may be at a crossroads, aware that any decision that you make will bring about significant change. The choice can be an obvious one, or perhaps the only viable one. You know that this choice must be made and you are facing it with maturity and level-headedness.
He is making his choice despite being hesitant to kill Rize, because he believes this is what must be done to save everyone, even if it has its downsides
Kaneki is at Judgement, but he has not reached the finish line yet. The World card is about reentering the world with a complete understanding and Kaneki at the moment is basically stuck in the Underworld and has to get out. The moment Kaneki emerges from the pit is the moment he has reached the World and is the moment he has to become more involved with the world around him. Kaneki is going through his trial of Judgement, but the end is not that near yet.
This finally gets us to the poems that Ishida has written that are pretty much about this event and these latest chapters. You can read it fully here.
Interesting thing to note is that poem is divided into three sections. I’ve already talked enough about how the announcement about TG:re ending was handled in an extremely unusual way so I won’t get into that now, but one of those strange things was the three chapter countdown we got so suddenly. My theory is that the three chapter countdown for the climax of the story is meant to represent the Final Judgement and each of these sections describes one of the chapters. The first section should represent chapter 177 and is from Kaneki’s point of view.
(1)
The end of the trial
All lies are being revealed.
All sins are being judged.
A reference to the Final Judgement and Judgement phase of the Fool’s Journey. Facing Rize is the end of the trial for Kaneki and Furuta was what started it.
The first thing that disappoints you is anger,
and if you’re sick of being mad, then it will try to kill you.
This bit is rather vague, but it seems to fit with Kaneki’s feelings toward the world and Rize. He is no longer mad at the world, but currently it and Rize too is trying to hurt him
A god that is willing to murder for atonement,
is no different than you people.
Kaneki is being put into the position of Jesus or an angel and is doing all this to take responsibility for his actions. Ultimately he is put into a situation where has to kill Rize to atone for his actions and in this chapter he even talks about how he is not special compared to everyone else.
Next is a single leaf from a fig tree
that conceals a body without leaving a trace.
It carries through while it is still vivid.
In Garden, Adam and Eve covered their private parts with fig leaves after eating the forbidden apple and becoming ashamed of the fact that they were naked. Before that they were free of sin, but this event changed everything and when they were banished from the Garden. This is probably a reference to Rize who escaped from the Garden and started living irresponsibly and “in sin” until she was captured and ended up in the fate she currently is in.
As blood spills in that moment, you softly laugh.
Blood spills as Kaneki attacks Rize
(2)
The ark is being swayed like a casket.
V called the Dragon their Ark
It is swaying like a casket since both Kaneki and Ayato got trapped inside as it collapses and the V agents too are finally defeated and this is the end of their journey, the Ark only led to V’s doom
“It’s okay if a cute person catches your eye!”
And then I went blind.
God is resentful because of his lost eyesight.
This is a reference to Kaneki’s first meeting with Rize. He at first regretted catching Rize’s eye, but in chapter 176 came to terms with it and thought it was a good thing since it helped him meet all the important people in his life.
It is in quotes though. Not only did Rize catch Kaneki’s eye, but Kaneki also caught Rize’s eye
And she went blind thanks to it as it was what led to her capture by Furuta and her current cruel fate. The one who feels resentment about the event is Rize
Because of your self-righteousness,
how many have had their blood spilled,
how many have suffocated in the depths of the sea?
Reference to Kaneki’s flaws what eventually caused him to fail and kill half of Tokyo and also perhaps a reference to events even before that where Kaneki caused the death of lots of people due to his flaws. This also happens to be a something Rize and Furuta to an extent share with him
It is what Rize called Kaneki out on at the Torii gates, but as Kaneki tried to move forward, Rize stayed behind
The buildings are gravestones floating in the sea.
And as they creak, the crooked foundation
one day breaks with a quick snap.
If Tokyo is the sea where all the people Kaneki killed died, the buildings that were wrecked by his Dragon form in the process are the gravestones along with all the other oviducts, including the one Kaneki and Rize are in right now. It too breaks with a quick snap in this latest chapter
That is when you experience the dull figures with your eyes.
That is when you stack up the limbs of someone you love.
That is when you get tired and fall asleep.
It happens, so abruptly.
Submerging beneath the sea again.
Kaneki falls asleep inside the Dragon and submerges beneath the sea once again, this time unable to escape.
Stacking up the limbs of someone you love could refer to Ayato since Kaneki was trying to look for him before he got stuck inside the Dragon or it could be referring something yet to come since it is talked about later in the poem.
People are bound to lose.
Our gradual burial at sea.
Everyone I know has died,
and I cry to the point of dying.
Before long, everyone became a pillar of salt
and it too, dissolved into the sea.
(3)
If the world ends for someone I know, then that’s okay.
The cradle swayed and disintegrated.
The sea filled up with salt and dried out.
A throat is punched with holes, and all the blood began to sing.
You will no longer be able to stop laughing.
When the world ends, the last person alive will truly think he is a villain.
It has been pointed out several times during these last chapters that everyone will eventually die
Kaneki however was not bothered by it as he said he was going to always strive forward.
This time it seems like he was the one to “die” while everybody else lives, a repeat of V14 despite the poem suggesting there being an inversion of Kaneki surviving while everyone else dies.
I already mentioned how Kaneki is connected to the resurrection of the dead when I talked about him being Gabriel of the Judgement tarot card and this is how it might happen. Furuta already talked about how the old Nagaraj shared some of his life force even if he probably killed more people than he gave life to.
After, which he turned into stone.
Perhaps the stone in question represents the salt pillars in the poem, the act of taking and giving life goes with the all of Judgement symbolism too. Kaneki eventually is going to be the key to resurrections according to all the symbolism I already talked about so perhaps now that Kaneki is separated from everyone else, he feels like he’s the only one left on Earth, feels like everybody he loves is dead. The V14 parallels I talked about still apply since this is the exact same thing that gave Kaneki amnesia. After his confrontation with Arima, he was stuck in a jail cell and wanted to reunite with everyone before being made to believe that they were all dead.
Now too after his confrontation with Furuta, he ended up being imprisoned again separated from all his loved ones, just like now he is meant to stay away from them for “1000 years” before the Final Judgement can occur. After all a total destruction is needed until the Earth and Heavens can be reborn and it was said that those with Washuu kagune have the power to change the world, this being Rize and Kaneki’s kagune too
Maybe Furuta was right that it was all will be in vain, or maybe it’s just a brief obstacle to be overcome. The world being reborn would be a valid reason for Ishida to separate the final resolution into its own part rather than include it with :re, it would also give it the same feel as Part 1 had when it ended. I’ve also before talked about why it would be a valid reason to divide TG into three acts, the third one happening right after the climax.
There’s also another poem that Ishida released, the Phosphenes poem found here: (x) The art that came with it is interesting in particular, because the number in the corner is almost the same as 179, the supposed final chapter that I believe will be about Kaneki and Rize
If behaving like a god is a sin, even the act of creating life would be blasphemous. Wouldn’t doing this be mocking the gods?
The act of creating life is brought up again and as I previously pointed out, whatever Kaneki now does underground might lead to resurrections, creation of life that even Furuta talked about. The poem seems to be implying though that something even worse than creating life is being done.
Wanting to be judged, I entered the prison of my own free will. I play around with sludge in a silent room. “So you’ve come back again,” I was being cursed at with a timberless voice.
That place was dazzlingly beautiful.
Again, Kaneki entering the bottomless pit to meet Rize can be considered his final rite of Judgement and that quote probably belongs to Rize as she meets Kaneki again after he left him at the Torii gates. Kaneki drowned in the sea like she hoped he would and they’re now reunited.
The area formed from kagune is sludgy, but yet so beautiful as Rize herself looks like a godly being. It’s important to note that this meeting with Rize is the climax of his Judgement, the end of the trial as the previous poem said. Kaneki moved to Judgement after his meeting with Rize at the Torii gates and now he’s reunited with her at the sea of corpses and being tested to see if he can truly move on and reach the World, end of his journey.
I was starving to death, and then from when I was gnawing on someone’s body, that’s right, from that moment, it all became strange. There definitely have must have been poison in there. Only beautiful merely to the eye, and shit.
This reminds me of the myth of Persephone who was abducted to the Underworld (coincidentally this bottomless pit where Rize and Kaneki are right now is also near the Underworld/Hell) and ate some pomegranate seeds that forced her to stay there during winter months since she had eaten the food of the Underworld. Chapter 162 happened to be called “Holding a Pomegranate” and it was the chapter where Kaneki woke up after returning from the Torii gates where Rize is. The reverse happening now is fitting, especially now that the latest chapter talked about the poison Rize emitted.
There’s a spider lily too, an ominous flower that typically bloom in graveyards and is associated with death. They grow in Hell and guide the dead to their next reincarnation. They specifically symbolize lost memory, abandonment and never meeting someone again.
I don’t want to put anything in my mouth, I don’t want to hear anything. I don’t want to see anything, anything at all.
The three wise monkeys are related to the sins we’ve committed and therefore fits with the theme of Judgement.
Place myself on a scale, along with the things being sold off, along with the ripped-apart bodies given away in pieces, along with playing by peeling off scabs, don’t, don’t.
Throw away everything you don’t need out the window. It’s okay if you fall and die. Until the very end, lend your ears to just the sounds fading away.
Once again this seems to be related to the previous poem and Kaneki losing people that matter to him and being left alone, the scale line in particular reminds me of chapter 140 of part 1.
This was the last moment of self reflction for Kaneki before his end and with all the V14 parallels we will probably get this too since the inner monologue in chapter 177 was instead more meant to be a reference to Yoshimura’s words (x) I suspect the next and last chapter will be exclusively in Kaneki’s head, because of this and also because of the parallels to events 100 chapters ago. Latest chapters have all had a reference to something exactly 100 chapters ago, between 76 and 176 there was this moment with similar paneling and theme about living
In chapter 77 we had Urie venturing and finding Torso, in chapter 177 we have Kaneki venturing underground while and finding Rize, both struggling on the way
In chapter 78 we have Torso explaining his backstory and Mutsuki becoming sympathetic towards him despite all the awful things he’s done to them. Chapter ends with Mutsuki potentially about to meet their end in the hands of Torso after having been captured by them for a while
In chapter 177 we have Kaneki feeling bad about killing Rize since he was always sympathetic towards her despite her originally trying to kill him and starting his tragedy, now Rize traps Kaneki and potentially is about to get him killed. The reason I mention this is, because chapter 79 is exclusively about Mutsuki, them being stuck inside their own head and realizing new things about themselves. A moment of self reflection and discovery just like what Kaneki went through in V14. Chapter ends on Mutsuki discovering something awful they’ve done while they were spaced out and start laughing like a maniac.
Sounds similar to the end of the last poem, doesn’t it?
A throat is punched with holes, and all the blood began to sing.
You will no longer be able to stop laughing.
When the world ends, the last person alive will truly think he is a villain.
This Phosphenes poem though finishes with this:
Hey, how many things did you get that you wanted?
Kaneki in the end found all the things he wanted, but…
…the field is filled with our old friends, red spider lilies.
We are once again going through a period of transition, Kaneki has “died” and his loved ones are left waiting. The manga will end, but soon a new part will be made that continues after a time skip. A new manga for a new world, which is fitting since this references the Book of Revelation. There will be “1000 years” of peace before the bottomless pit is opened and out comes the Dragon with Kaneki and a new conflict arises. It won’t last long though since it is easily stopped and soon after all the dead are resurrected and their sins are judged. This is what part 3 will be about and once Kaneki comes back, he’ll have completed his trial of Judgement and reach the end of his character arc. In the end the Judgement always leads to the World, which in both the Book of Revelation and the Fool’s Journey is a happy ending.
I know I’ve been annoying with all these theories for almost a year now, but since we’re apparently close to the end of the series and we might never get an answer, I’ll just say that I’ll keep on believing that something was up with at least Uta and Noro (even if for Noro it was only because of Eto), as well as maybe Itori and Nico.
Were they related to the Washuus? Were they linked to the two previous OEGs in the timeline? What was the deal with Uta’s tattoos? I doubt we’ll find out about any of this at this point so, if we really aren’t given any other hint before the end, I’ll personally take the general idea from all these theories as a headcanon.
I find it pretty awesome that Kuzen’s small act of defiance against V has sprouted into a full-fledged rebellion against them. By abandoning them and their values to try to create a small locus of peace in the world they corrupted, Kuzen proved another world was possible – the world that his friends and pupils are struggling to create now.
Kaiko realises the connection when Yomo mentions Anteiku, and much like Furuta’s criticism of Kaneki in the preceding chapter, Kaiko’s criticism reveals much more of his own flaws than those of his enemies. He can only see the world through a lens of manipulation and domination, and since his foes aren’t controlled by him, he assumes they must be controlled by Kuzen. He fails to understand their individuality and independence of thought and action, inspired by Kuzen rather than manipulated by him.
Kaiko’s obsession with the order of the herd is seen in his frequent use of the ‘we’ pronoun, referring to the collective interests of V. This is in stark contrast to the selfish Furuta, whom Kaiko naturally did not get along with – particularly in regards to his bad manners, which defy Kaiko’s orderliness and propriety.
The uniform faceless mass of black hats, coats and katanas that makes up V emphasises this collective, with Kaiko acting as the spokesman of the whole. He cannot stand rebels. Even now he resents Kuzen for breaking from the collective, disrupting its perfect unity, and still wishes to force him back into it. In fact, nearly every time we see Kaiko he’s mulling over Kuzen. That’s one hell of an axe to grind.
In the first, he joyously proclaims that Kuzen’s rebellion has come to nought, laying his anxieties at rest, while in the background Kaneki and Eto, the successors of Kuzen’s legacy, talk; thereby proving Kaiko wrong. In the second, his frustration is so great he breaks even his own rule of manners by swearing at the effect of Kuzen’s legacy in fermenting rebellion and disturbing his ‘peace’.
But his paranoia is justified – that single act of rebellion has caused his entire house of cards to come tumbling down. In the first series’ final arc, V’s control seems an unbreakable birdcage.
It’s implied in this scene that V orchestrated the Anteiku Raid to punish Kuzen’s insubordination, placing their well-polished heel firmly over Kuzen’s head. But in the final arc of :re, it’s Kuzen’s legacy that triumphs over V, and as for their birdcage…
Eto reveals the fragility of their seemingly solid control in the panels below. It rests precariously on a balance that is bound to eventually be overturned by the legions of oppressed beneath it, both the ghouls being slaughtered and the humans tricked into an endless war.
The return of Eto, as Kuzen’s child, is the most explicit symbol of the triumph of Kuzen’s legacy. Kaiko even refers to her as ‘Yoshimura’.
The importance both of Kuzen and Eto herself in this arc reflects their significance in the Anteiku Raid. Eto was the first major destabilising element created by Kuzen’s disloyalty, and Kaiko directly attributes Eto’s actions to Kuzen:
So Eto’s victory over V is Kuzen’s victory as well, and like him, this chapter she has finally broken free from their control.
The spectre of revolution has long been coming for V, and Kuzen’s small disruption of the system has led to its full-scale collapse.
nah it seems that we really were meant to take Miza saying “let him sleep” at face value!
I’m not sure that Eto was ever dead either. V clearly picked her up in Cochlea and have been keeping her since. They have Nico who can heal so its possible he kept her going when she was meant to die
When Amon attacked Donato, Owl lost power telling us it was Donato remote controlling Eto via the Cross in her neck
after Donato died, the Cross melted away and she regenerated
So rather than remote controlling her entire body like Koma and Irimi, they had cut off her head to remove her own conscious thought. In it’s place was the kagune cross doing the “thinking” for Owl via Donato and preventing her regenerating. Once that was gone “POP”. If Eto were truly dead there probably wouldn’t have been a need to remove her head ya know?
So yeah, I think there are a few distinctions between whats happening with these characters being “””resurrected””
@paradoxhamartia WAIT, what if this is (partially) related to Eto’s gift from the Roze arc????
She possibly knew what Kanou was after (with Dragon and all, just like Arima knew about Furuta’s plan apparently), so WHAT IF this is the reason Kaneki can now go all out as an ukaku (which would also explain the owl pattern on his torso, I agree)????
Long story short, it turns out that this far in :Re, there are still fans who get confused about the timeline that we were given (I’m aware that overlapping different hints is not always easy though, so no pressure).So, due to a certain post I saw yesterday and that I can’t get out of my head, I decided to make a recap post on the subject to hopefully clear up some confusion.
(Please note that all of this is based on the assumption that the timeline I mentioned is accurate/can be trusted.)
Firstly, there is supposedly no need to wonder about the identity of the Nagaraj who’s a kakuja ghoul who went on a rampage 100 years ago or so, because…
we already know he’s the One Eyed Washuu Matsuri mentioned in ch151 and we even saw what he looked like on the same occasion.
Of course, one could argue that Matsuri is lying/doesn’t know the real truth but… (personal opinion here) it’s not really the kind of plot twists Sensei seems to work with in general?
So, without mentioning theories about a link between Uta & the One Eyed Washuu (if just because of the resemblance in ch151), while I can understand the need to imagine more complicated plot twists, I find it hard to consider that, say Itori, could be the Nagaraj of 100 years ago when we already saw who he supposedly was in ch151.
However, again considering the timeline we were given throughout :Re, since there is another OEG/OEK that started a second rebellion after the Nagaraj’s but before Eto’s, I think it’s legit to wonder about their identity because it’s bound to be addressed eventually.
I personally have 3 suspects at the moment:
Noro
Itori
and Donato
(since this post is a little late, considering the next chapter is soon, more below)
For Noro, I already explained why I thought it was a possibility along with the timeline here.
For Itori, I advanced “arguments” in different posts [x][x][x][x] but to make a really general and superficial summary (something I actually put together for @hamliet who I think love the idea of Itori being a OEG):
This is obviously not something to take super seriously (actually I made this set as some kind of joke compared to the one I had made for Uta a long time ago), but I think that with the posts I linked to above, there is at least a small basis to consider the idea.
In general the second OEG of the timeline was less addressed than the Nagaraj, because they were defeated by the newly created V and didn’t have the opportunity to go on a rampage like the One Eyed Washuu or even Kaneki himself.
So far, Kaneki mentioned them in ch121, Nishiki in ch128 and maybe Roma briefly in ch135 (when she said that she went to Cochlea after “the grand party” and Roma being 51 years old, she would have only bee, born in time for the second rebellion), but as far as I could notice that’s it, which is not a lot compared to the One Eyed Washuu/Nagaraj.
Of course, that’s not the only theory about Itori’s identity and past, another popular one being that she’s a breeder (like Rize was supposed to be), possibly already alive by the time the Nagaraj went on a rampage (@cirrocumulus-cloud made a good recap post on the subject after the latest chapter and you can read it here).
[Additional note: the ending cards of Root A episode 8, which was about Yoshimura’s backstory, were
So as always make whatever you want from that, but Eto and Kaneki are OEGs, there are theories that Uta could have a link to the One Eyed Washuu, so there might be a reason Sensei decided to make a card for Itori at the same time too]
Finally, for Donato, it gets slightly more complicated and symbolic…
…knowing that this is the biggest hint, as far as I’m concerned.
We already know thanks to Itori that the Clowns are ghouls tired of despairing, which means that it would seem legit that Donato lost more than Amon and his orphanage throughout his life, before he ended up in Cochlea for 18 years or so.
However, despite that, he’s also the suspect I am the least sure about because:
I don’t think he’s a Washuu (not that all OEGs have to be Washuus, look at Kaneki and Eto), but he’s also not Japanese, so it’s hard to see why a Russian OEG would come to Japan to launch a rebellion if he’s neither.
Not to ramble, but I also don’t think he’s such a strong ghoul. I mean, he’s definitely SS rated but I think his “cloning abilities” are possibly triggered by ghouls who were hinted they could be Washuus (and thus “their blood holds profound power”, by Kanou, ch149), namely Uta for the Clowns’ raid arc and Nico healing him in the last chapter.
best theoretical “proof” I have is that he apparently couldn’t make a clone of himself in order to escape Urie’s father and run away with Amon, which is how he ended up in Cochlea.
Nonetheless, there is also some symbolism that might vouch he’s still a likely candidate for the second OEG of the timeline, but since this isn’t really something I’m good at, I’ll let @linkspooky explain! :3
Okay so people want to know what the fuck this new “Owl” is so I’ll explain as much as I can from my own perspective.
First of all, there primarily three characters who people are speculating the identity of this Owl to be, so let’s go through those first.
1) Eto Yoshimura
The most obvious choice, as this Owl bears by far the most resemblance to Eto, even down to the finest details such as how Eto always leaps (and crashes) into the action out of nowhere, clad in her massive Owl kakuja.
This Owl kakuja is also of comparable size to Eto’s own kakuja although the form appears much different this time around. The form that this Owl kakuja takes specifically mirrors the same appearance which Amon’s kakuja took after breaking out of containment, who also has the same kakuhou.
The last and most obvious point is that the body of the host is wrapped in bandages, and needless to say the only character who has worn bandages is Eto. The only part that throws me off about this Owl is that you can see unusual instruments attached to its back, which is something we haven’t seen before.
I personally believe this Owl is 99% most likely Eto’s corpse who is now ironically being used in the same way that she once used Noro.
2) Karren Von Rosewald
Another popular choice with many reasons behind it. One of the first reasoning’s is the inclusion of the chapter 165 illustration that Ishida drew specifically for Shuu. So this led people to believing either that this Owl has a connection to Shuu in some way, or that Ishida simply loves drawing Shuu all the damn time (which is just as likely as evidence would show).
Another big reason is that we never did find out what happened to Karren’s body after her corpse was obtained by the CCG, and I do think it’s very likely that Karren has been kept for further possible use. We also know that Karren has been experimented on by Eto as well through the usage of the Owl kagune, so it’s not impossible that this Owl kakuja could indeed be Karren.
I personally don’t believe that this Owl is Karren mostly because it feels like an extremely forced red herring which wouldn’t hold much purpose. Seeing that the host has had their head removed also means that nobody has any way of identifying her either.
3) Hairu Ihei
The least likely among the three in my opinion however there are fair reasons for why this Owl could be Hairu as well. The main reasoning behind this speculation is that the readers have already been set up with the foreshadowing that Hairu is going to be resurrected, and most likely with the Owl kakuhou according to Hairu’s birthday illustration.
The thing is, the only character that Hairu has ties to in the current story is Ui, and Ui literally had an image of Hairu in his head before he was about to take on this Owl. Seeing that this Owl has no head, there would be no way for Ui to identify the host, so I personally don’t see the narrative value in this Owl being Hairu.
I think if Hairu were to be resurrected then it would be more effective if it was executed a different way rather than this. Besides, Hairu has bigger boobs than the girl we saw inside the Owl.
Feel free to comment your own opinions on this matter, whether you agree or disagree.
Extra detail that I think is worth considering, and adds some impact to the theory of it being Hairu:
Old confirmed that in the Japanese version, the Owl is attempting to say something that resembles “Koori”. That strongly indicates a connection to the last person on the Suspect list, since Hairu is the only one that calls him by his given name.
There’s a good chance this Owl is a product of Lab 4, where Kanou continued his experiments. That have would give him multiple potential sources for an Owl kakuhou, since Amon was being experimented on there and he may have had access to left-over Yoshimura or even Eto herself. And it was also where Hairu was being stored, from what Furuta showed Ui.
midnight-in-town 