Hey I wonder about if Yuri will ever search/find out about why Oku and Obaba used to be exorcists but quit at some point? Which led them to become homeless, I suppose?
With everything about Section 13 and Asylum, it would be interesting if Sensei were to show that a few exorcists couldn’t maybe handle a few secrets they found out about and chose to leave the Organization instead of being associated with it?
Especially since one could argue that the way they died was a little suspicious. I mean, there is no real argument or proof, because Yuri was 6, the scene was quick and they said it was a fire but was it really accidental? Who knows.
… Now that I think about it though, It’s kinda the same about Yuri’s biological family’s situation because…
what about this super shady family business that’s quickly mentioned?
I’d consider it random, just giving a reason to why she had no family in the first place, but her family name is also the name of the demon king of water at least in English. Maybe there is a difference in Japanese when it comes to how it’s written, I have no idea, but it would be interesting if it wasn’t a coincidence, leading to Yuri reasearching about her past and the people she used to live with.
So was Oku’s name really “Oku” and Yuri decided her sons would have a (made-up) related family name because he was like her surrogate father? Or maybe it was actually “Okumura” and it’s because she’ll research about him, find out about this and why he left the Organization, that she’ll give his name to her sons?
I don’t know but I feel ch100 and ch101 still have bits that are shady despite this trip in the past being supposed to be about giving Rin answers…
Hi Anon, no worries your English is great! And actually I already explained here.
To make this simple: Amaimon is neutral in the big Order vs Illuminati conflict, he’s just helping Mephisto with some stuff because he owes him (most likely because of his current vessel)…
…but he doesn’t care about whose side ends up winning.
Meanwhile, this is his reaction to Shiemi:
and to Mephisto once he confronted him about finally realizing about Shiemi’s powers:
So Amaimon’s anger in the scene above is not related to Shiemi but to Mephisto: he’s mad that Mephisto didn’t tell him sooner about Shiemi + he’s most likely also mad about the fact that Mephisto definitely intends on making him choose a side in this conflict (”you have little free time left”), despite the fact that Amaimon considers himself neutral.
And what conclusion does this lead you to? Amaimon wanted to stay neutral but now that he has realized about Shiemi’s powers, he knows that he won’t be able to just be an observer => so whoever Shiemi is, she’s basically the chain now locking Amaimon on the Order’s side.
I’m pretty sure you’re aware of all the theories about Shiemi and Shemihaza and it’s actually not very surprising to imagine a link between them and Amaimon who’s the King of Earth, especially when Shemihaza’s symbol is…
and Shiemi used to mention something called “the Garden of Amahara”.
Both Shemihaza and Amaimon come from Gehenna, we don’t know what kind of link they might have, but it could be that they’re pals or linked in some ways. And if that’s the case, then Shiemi being related to Shemihaza (being their host or nephilim) would mean that Amaimon’d have to keep an eye on her (either because that’s important to him or because he has no choice in the matter).
So I really don’t think Amaimon is in to hurt Shiemi: he already kicked her during the fight against Yukio & Satan, so we know he should give 0 care and yet now he’s angry after realizing who she is. To me that implies he’s clearly going to (have to) change his way of behaving towards her, whatever the reason is.
Also, I have to say this: the current arc is rather complicated and the main trio Rin/Shiemi/Yukio got blasted into three different directions (Yukio & Illuminati, Rin & the past, Shiemi & the Grigori). That’s why, before they can all meet again, they’ll first need the help of other characters and we may end up with Amaimon being quite relevant to Shiemi’s personal arc before the others catch up.
I hope this makes sense, please read the post I linked to, it may have additional explanations! Have a nice day Anon. :))
AHHHHHHHHHHHHH, could it be why???
Shemihaza seems to be the Grigori most involved with Section 13 (and look at what Lucifer is saying: “give me hope too”), so assuming that the theories about Shiemi having a link to them are true, maybe Amaimon is indebted towards Shemihaza the same way he feels indebted to Mephisto and is “helping him out” (because of the vessel he gained from Section 13)?
That could explain why he got mad at Mephisto upon realizing too late who Shiemi seemed to be, because he should have never treated her so roughly or something, since he owes her whole lineage???
It works no matter if Shiemi is a nephilim of Shemihaza or their next host. Just an idea. :3
Can we talk about Lucifer’s wish for a durable vessel? This is from ch102:
and the following is from ch104, before
and after Amaimon got his own functional new vessel…
as well as when Satan finally possessed Goro:
I find it’s quite interesting that Lucifer is presented as having a lot of faith about “being rewarded for his suffering” and that one day some sort cosmic justice will give him what he deserves (which is a new functional vessel) when, back then, he was thought to be the highest and most powerful demon to the two worlds of Assiah and Gehenna.
Then Satan finally possessed a vessel and developed an ego but no one (Mephy aside because he exists everywhen) knew who he was at first, yet look at how Mephisto and Amaimon explain Gehenna’s hierarchy now, 20 years later:
So you know, it’s as if… before Satan even technically gained an ego and started to really exist as who he is, Lucifer already believed that there was a greater being (a God) above all of them and he kinda gained the proof of that (the reward to his faith) through Satan’s possession of Goro, 20 years ago.
That eventually led to the creation of the Illuminati, once Section 13 was destroyed (most likely during the Blue Night), and the pursuit of the goals he already was mentioning to Shemihaza which are…
…starting with making sure both he and Satan get a vessel because “it’s fair and there shouldn’t be an Assiah/Gehenna limit”.
So Lucifer, as Gehenna #2 (just like most of the Baals actually), is very faithful to that God that he already believed in before Satan was even conscious of existing & being significant to others + he believes he understands others and that bringing peace to everyone in the form of equality is The Answer.
Facing him in comparison tho’, you’ve got Mephisto, who’s probably jaded about Satan being his Father/God/blahblah, because he’s seen this shit in idk how many timelines and his only priority is for Assiah not to disappear, because humans are interesting and he doesn’t see the point of not being able to enjoy what Assiah and humans can bring to him.
In other words, he’s an absolutely selfish jerk who can casually say that “yes you all are my pawns but you are only worms to me so it’s only fitting I treat you as such”, as well as pretend wanting to give Rin to Satan while also claiming to want to use Rin in order to take down Lucifer. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
And Mephy + other powerful demons created (and are still leading) the True Cross Order, an organization that’s supposed to be about Protecting Humans While Fighting Against Demons but that’s also actually about giving strong vessels to more powerful demons.
So it’s literally
because the contrast between Lucifer & Samael, Illuminati &True Cross Order is huge on every aspect, so honestly I love what Sensei is doing with it, because it’s a total mindfuck (I get why Shima has so much fun spying for both sides, with both sides fully aware + why Yukio said “fuck all of them” xDDD).
I still think that
Jenny will be relevant again later in the flashback, because being mentioned twice when she supposedly moved on from her old friendships is beyond weird?? Maybe once Yuri gets pregnant, in three years, since she’s said to be an elite and all?
Also, I think we can all pretty much agree that Rick will probably die a sad death around the Blue Night :// rip in advance and I fear his wife and son may end up similarly T_T
Anyway, ch103 is really interesting as a focus on Yuri (16 years old) and Shiro’s (22 years old) dynamic, because we found out it gradually got better over time. I’m now looking forward to how they managed from “awkward confession” (29 years ago) to Yuri still casually flirting with him, like when he brought Shura to her (18 years ago). And if Shiro ever caved, of course.
What’s even more interesting though is that, despite that we already knew “rinka” had a special attachment to Yuri, it’s to the point that now it seems to sense whenever she’s not okay, be it physically (protecting her from Shiro’s wrath) or emotionally (after Shiro rejected her).
And actually I thought maybe that’s why eventually it ended up becoming Satan through possessing a human (Goro) and developing an ego?
Because maybe initially lil “rinka” just wanted to cheer Yuri up, it’s just that developing an ego through possessing a human made him, well, the horrible demon God we met a few times.
Just like Mephisto explained for the rest of them Baals.
Honestly, I think Goro being possessed (the cliffhanger of ch103) was around 29 years ago and, besides a probably huge boom inside Section 13, nothing else happened with him, Satan, or Yuri back then.
My evidence of this is Arthur because he was already born and probably a teenager when the Blue Night happened:
and also in general the Blue Night matches with the twins’ birth 16 years ago:
because that’s when Suguro Tatsuma’s dad, Shima Takezou and Konekomaru’s father all died.
Moving on, I still think that Shiro is possibly the twins’ biological dad, even if how/when while including Satan in the equation is a bit hard to figure out entirely for now (and assuming of course that the Order is not wrong about who hosted Satan between Yuri and the dad). xD
Clearly though, Yuri never stopped loving him and, if Shura was so jealous of Yuri for years, it could be that even as a kid she noticed that Shiro was obviously taken by her too.
Doesn’t mean Shiro ever caved, of course, but I find interesting that he was still a very cold guy when he just got Shura (18 years ago) and yet with Tatsuma…
he seemed less aggressive, more helpful and similar to the man we met as Rin’s foster dad (16/17 years ago). Mentioning this moment btw, I doubt Shiro knew back then whose kid he was supposed to kill with that sword.
Finally, there is Mephisto’s constant warning about the flashback ending “in tragedy”, but Rin already knows that, having never met his mother? So why would Mephy warn him several times? Because something will happen between Shiro & Yuri and Rin should keep in mind that it will end badly anyway?
I don’t know for sure, but for now it does seem like Yuri wouldn’t have minded having a family with Shiro, if ch89 is an indication of anything.
And if Shiro caved at some point (maybe taking care of Shura, a kid, made him realize some stuff, idk), that could explain why he seems genuinely different and less cold when he met Suguro Tatsuma.
Last thing: if Shiro is the twins’ dad, the question is did he ever know? There are plenty of reasons he would not have been able to kill Yuri’s sons, the fact he loved her being the most prominent, but whether he knew or not…
I’m guessing the favor he owed Mephisto, should he yield to a demon (baby demon Rin or possessed-by-Satan!Yuri?), would have forced him to raise the twins as “weapons for the Order” anyway.
What I mean is, if Shiro didn’t know, then Mephisto just had to ask him to raise the twins and then the rest is history. However, if Shiro knew he was the biological dad to Satan’s sons, Mephisto could have forbidden him from ever telling them as a part of that favor.
Because clearly Mephisto is the one who allowed the twins’ existence. It means that whether Shiro wanted to raise them from the beginning or was forced to, he had to obey Mephisto on some stuff no matter what (especially since we don’t know what conditions his Morinas’ contract could have been updated with).
I like Shiro raising the twins out of love for Yuri, it’s really beautiful, but I also like the twist that he might really be their biological dad because, be it for Rin…
or Yukio…
that possible truth is going to be very hard to swallow.
Sorry for the long post, I just can’t wait to find out. 😀
Sorry if someone already made a post on the subject, but I was thinking about the last chapters’ title and, considering that Rin is currently having a journey throughout the past and that Mephy is the one guiding him through it, it’d make sense to consider thatthe numbers in the titles are referring to Time.
The question now is whether this possible time unit refers to the past itself or to the present/current timeline from ch99.
First idea is that it could be referring to the past, because as seen in ch101
and ch102
the number of years seem to match the first number of the titles.
In that case, then I guess the other two numbers of the title can only be referring to weeks (because a year = 365 days or 12 months or 52 weeks), meaning that, for example, the title of ch102 would be “5 years and 35 weeks” from when the flashback started for Rin.
Besides, the titles referring to the time quickly passing by for Rin’s journey would also make sense since Mephy is only showing him the pieces of the past he needs to understand what Mephy wants him to understand.
If not the past though, then the second possibility is that the titles are rather referring to the time passing by in the present/current timeline (the one we left in ch99) while Rin is away.
For example, by the time Rin got to the past in ch100, either 40 minutes or 40 seconds had passed in the present for Shiemi, Izumo, Shura, Yukio, Suguro and co. Similarly, while Rin was witnessing the events of ch101, either 4 hours and 36 minutes or 4 minutes and 36 seconds had passed in the present Rin is from (and same idea for ch102).
This possibility would also make sense because Rin left the present in a real moment of crisis. To quote Neuhaus, even Mephy who is king of time shouldn’t be lazing around despite having just been shot in the head.
So having Rin leaving for some time (and going to the past), no one besides Mephy knowing where he is, before he’s to reappear later in the present timeline (probably at even more crucial moment) could be a part of Mephy’s complex plan too, we never know.
Just some musings. We’ll see if either possibility will still work with future chapters, but keep in mind it could be something else entirely. Time is bound to be a complicated matter with Mephisto. x)
So I came to the conclusion that the titles are definitely about the timeline of the Rin’s journey through the past:
Because we started the flashback “40 years ago” and…
40 years ago – 29 years ago = 11 years ever since the beginning of the flashback.
And it’s actually interesting to notice that the two sets of number for all the titles so far are relating to “40 years ago”!
ch100= 40-0=40 => 0:40
ch101: 40-4=36 => 4:36
ch102: 40-5=35 => 5:35
ch103: 40-11=29 => 11:29
Working well so far, Sensei.
I suppose the flashback will end when the counter reaches 40:0or something. In that case, it could mean that Rin’s journey through the past will go further than just the blue night and Yuri’s death.
And I share because I’m aware we enjoy those in the fandom. xD
So you know how…
But what if it was meant literally? Not death as a familiar behind a Morinas contract, but rather the whole concept of death as being kin of Time in Assiah/Gehenna?
Wouldn’t that mean that…
in a way Mephisto could actually bring the dead back? You know, just like how he’s able to split some time axes from the original timeline, like he did for Neuhaus and Section 13? Or how his vessel dies slowly because he stops time for himself?
Speaking of Neuhaus, remember how in s1 of the anime he ended up working on a way to bring his wife back from the dead? Meanwhile in the manga he…
just finished
whatever he was working on in that frozen Section 13 time axis????
So what if Mephisto gave Neuhaus a way to work on bringing the dead back, using a part of his own knowledge related to death being a kin of his? And what if Neuhaus is working for him because he can use this to bring his wife back just like in s1 or something, while Mephisto intends on bringing back someone else?
Because, you know who died way early on and who’s at the heart of the story in a way?
And obviously Shiro dying at the beginning was narratively logical because it’s what triggered the whole story, with the Okumura twins being at the mercy of both the Order and Illuminati without him to shield them.
Doesn’t mean it has to stay that way ‘till the end of the story though, especially since…
So I really wonder about a possible resurrection for Shiro slightly later when war starts, also mostly because we’re kinda missing someone powerful in the story…
And Shiro was a clone created from Azazel, specifically for the purpose of giving the Baals new vessels. However, after the blue night that started within Asylum, Section 13 was shut down and Shiro & Arthur are probably the only two clones who are still alive (assuming Arthur is indeed one of Lucifer’s clones).
And I know, maybe Azazel is really a nice demon king who doesn’t want to seek a new vessel because he’s fine staying in cristallized form. But the thing is, we have Shiemi who’s most likely linked to Shemihaza and we don’t know yet if she’s just a nephilim, or if she’s (going to be) Shemihaza’s vessel/host (clearly the plot is giving suspicious vibes about this part).
So let’s just assume for the sake of this crazy theory that Shemihaza might be coming back through Shiemi because…
…the Order needs to be at its strongest to face Illuminati…
…because Illuminati has most of the Baals on its side. Well, in that case, what if, on top of Shemihaza, Armumahel and Azazel are coming back too?
I already proposed an idea for Armumahel’s nephilim or host a while ago, so now I’m proposing undead!Shiro as Azazel’s vessel: Shiro was a clone meant to be possessed by a Baal after all and, even if Azazel isn’t Lucifer or Satan, he’ll still need a strong vessel to withhold him as long as it’s necessary.
Of course Shiro could also be brought back from the dead for reasons unrelated to Azazel but because Mephisto has another plan about him and the twins.
Just like a less crazy version of this theory is simply
So idk about you guys, but initially I was thinking that Rin’s journey would last until the twins’ birth (the blue night in theory) and until we could see how Shiro ended up raising them…
Because we already know this won’t end well for Yuri.
Now though, I JUST SCARED MYSELF because I realized that maybe the “tragedy” Mephisto mentioned might not be only referring to Yuri’s death.
I mean, Mephisto said to Rin that the whole point of showing him (and not Yukio) the past was because:
he has to face and accept the past, because it scares him (and he doesn’t need anyone to tell him it’s not a happy story) + because he needs to know the truth to get Yukio back.
But here I am wondering, are the circumstances of his and Yukio’s birth the only part of the past he “must accept” through this journey?
This flashback is about Yuri and Shiro, so if one goal is to learn about Yuri and accept to face what brought her death, what about…
Shiro’s death too? Because Rin is clearly still tormented about this and he never had the chance to truly face any of it.
The reason I’m thinking it might happen is also because Mephisto once did the following…
…he quoted what Shiro had told Rin all the way back in ch1, before he died.
And I know that Mephy is the King of Time and a real jerk, but still, I wonder if him quoting that moment in particular wouldn’t be because leading Rin back to this precise moment at the end of this journey is something he will do/did already a million times .
Anyway, that’s why I could see it: Rin witnessing how Shiro slowly changed, through Yuri’s death and through raising them,
to become the man he saw as his father… Until that day where he killed himself to make sure Satan wouldn’t get Rin, leaving him and Yukio to Mephisto and Shura instead.
That could make a good/painful ending point for this journey. Double times the pain for Rin of course, because he’ll have to go through his mom’s and (adoptive?) dad’s death, facing the fact that Satan was very probably just trying to get to him (his perfect vessel) both times. T_T
Also Abel Franken, the previous Paladin? Most likely a Samael clone (the German name being a strong hint of this), which is probably why Rin has the feeling he’s seen him somewhere before and Mephy is here like “:D” .
It seems all Paladins are taken amongst the few test subjects from Section 13 who make it Exwire and then Exorcist anyway.
Abel Franken => possibly one of Samael’s clones
Fujimoto Shiro => one of Azazel’s clones
Arthur August Angel => possibly one of Lucifer’s clones, thanks to Mephisto saying he was from Asylum too and to this
And the reason for that is probably because they’re under a Morinas’ contract related to Section 13 already, which makes it easier to moderate the information that’s passed around within the highest members of the Order (the Grigoris, the Paladin, Mephisto and some of the Arc Knights).
That and they’re strong (since they were cloned from the top 3 Baals), so they’re useful.
Angel is actually the only exception since he apparently lost his memories after the Blue Night (I’m highly suspicious of this, but we shall see)
which makes him the only Paladin that’s mostly unaware of many stuff going on within the Order, compared to Shiro or probably even Abel Franken.
But anyway, all that to say that Abel Franken = Samael’s clone. I wonder how awkward it must have been for him to interact with Mephisto LMAO.
midnight-in-town 